Common misunderstanding of Alaska Night Flying exemption.

4 Answers

1. 
   

   
   

   Wes Beard on Sep 23, 2012

   I agree with you that an Alaskan pilot who does not complete their night training within 12 months after receiving their certificate invalidates that license but it is still might be current so I can see why the FAA sent him a new plastic certificate. See §61.2.

   As to your question about any grandfathered clause… from my experience and reading other parts of the regulations list… §61.31 for example, that grandfathered clause would need to included in this specific regulation. It is obvious that there is no mention of a grandfathered clause in §61.110.

   So I decided to research if that clause was deleted. At the bottom of every regulation is a small paragraph showing changes in the regulation and cites the appropriate FR. For this regulation you have:

   [Doc. No. 25910, 62 FR 16298, Apr. 4, 1997; Amdt. 61–103, 62 FR 40904, July 30, 1997; Amdt. 61–110, 69 FR 44869, July 27, 2004]

   It was originally written in 1997 and updated in 2004. I looked up the 2003 version and it is exactly the same the current version except it is missing paragraph (c). No mention of a grandfathered clause. It may be in an older copy of the regulations but I would question whether or not that actually applies in your case.

   http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=50a27e7e09aff42b5cc4be7cd1c32c09&rgn=div8&view=text&node=14:2.0.1.1.2.5.1.6&idno=14

   http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/search/pagedetails.action?browsePath=Title+14%2FChapter+I%2FSubchapter+D%2FPart+61%2FSubpart+E%2FSection+61.110&granuleId=CFR-2003-title14-vol2-sec61-110&packageId=CFR-2003-title14-vol2&collapse=true&fromBrowse=true

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2. 
   

   
   

   Alex Clark on Sep 23, 2012

   OK I found something on the FAA questions and answers site. It took hours to read through it all.

   FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS 14 CFR, PART 61
   ARRANGED BY SECTION
   MAINTAINED BY ALLAN PINKSTON PILOT EXAMINER STANDARDIZATION TEAM, AFS-640 Contact: Allan Pinkston phone: (405) 954 – 6472 E-Mail:
   K.Allan.Pinkston@faa.gov

   Re: Questions Concerning § 61.110 of the Federal Aviation Regulations

   Dear Mr. Ballew:

   Tim Titus forwarded your email message to him regarding § 61.110 to me and asked me to respond.

   As you know, § 61.110(b) provides, in relevant part, that a person who receives flight training in and resides in the State of Alaska but does not meet the night flight training requirements of this section: (1) may be issued a pilot certificate with a limitation “Night flying prohibited” and (2) must comply with the appropriate night flight training requirements of this subpart within the 12-calendar month period after the issuance of the pilot certificate. At the end of that period, the certificate will become invalid for use until the person complies with the appropriate night training requirements of this subpart.

   The first question you posed was whether a person who added an ASES rating to his certificate (that was issued prior to August 7, 1997 with a night flying restriction) needed to comply with the night flying requirements within a year. You indicated that Allen Pinkston, AFS-640 said that he would have to satisfy the night flying training requirements. You asked if this was correct. Mr. Pinkston’s statement is correct.

   In the preamble to the Notice of Proposed Rulemaking that covered this particular regulation, the FAA stated:

   “However, a person who has been issued a pilot certificate without meeting the night flying requirements of this proposal, prior to effective date of this rule, would be allowed to continue to hold that pilot certificate with the night flying limitation. If the person seeks an additional rating or higher pilot certificate level, the person would be required to comply with the night flying requirements that are appropriate to the pilot certificate level.”

   Therefore, the person who adds a seaplane rating to his “old” certificate that has a night flying restriction must comply with the night flying training requirements. If he is takes his training in and resides in Alaska, he will have a period of one year from the date of issue of the “new” certificate in which to obtain the training. If he does not, his certificate is no longer valid. Any “grandfather privileges” are gone. If he did not take his training in and does not reside in Alaska, he must complete the night training prior to issuance of the new rating.

   As to your other questions concerning lost certificates or change of address, the fact that the replacement certificate has a new issue date would not trigger a requirement to comply with the night flying training requirements as the pilot has not added an additional rating or obtained a higher certificate level. He is simply replacing his lost certificate or changing his address. During a ramp check were an inspector to question the validity of that certificate, the pilot should explain that his certificate was issued to replace a lost certificate or to change his address on a certificate that was actually issued prior to August 4, 1997. He also might consider keeping a copy of his correspondence requesting the duplicate or change of address.

   You next asked about an individual who obtains a Private Pilot certificate ( I assume with ASEL rating) with the night flying prohibition and who, within a year, applies for and obtains an added rating (ASES). Then he gets an instrument rating, followed by an AMEL rating. At each stage, he is issued a new certificate with a new issue date. I understand your question to be “At what point does he have to comply with the night flying training requirements.

   He must comply with the night flying training requirements for ASE within one year of the date he obtained the private pilot certificate. Once the ASE night flying training requirement is completed, e.g. for ASEL, there is no additional night training requirement for an ASES rating. Neither is there a night flying training requirement for the instrument rating. The night flying training requirements for the other additional rating, i.e., AME, must be obtained within one year of the date the AME additional rating is obtained. If he fails to comply with the night flying training requirement when each is due, his certificate will be invalid for use when the first due date is missed. Where the training was not timely obtained for earlier ratings, the fact that the certificate is invalid for use may not be apparent to anyone examining the certificate and looking only at the issue date. Absent examination of the pilot’s logbook or some other investigation, discovery by anyone of the fact of invalidity is probably unlikely. Indeed, until a year has passed without any upgrade or added rating, the casual observer may have no indication that the certificate he is examining is invalid for use.

   You also asked, “What about an individual who no longer resides in Alaska as required by FAR § 61.110? The regulation permits issuance of a restricted certificate to a person who takes his training in and resides in Alaska. The regulation permits a period of 12 months following issuance during which the person must get the night flying training. An individual who took his training in and was a legal resident of Alaska at the time he was issued the certificate with the “night flying prohibited” restriction based on § 61.110 who later changes his residency to another state within the 12 month period following issuance would still have until the end of the 12 month period to obtain the night flying training.

   SO, AT ONE TIME THE FAA THOUGHT THERE WAS A GRANDFATHER CLAUS FOR ALL PILOTS WHO HAD NO NIGHT FLYING TRAINING BEFORE AUG 1997. BUT,,, THERE IS NOTHING IN THE REGS THAT MAKES REFERENCE TO IT, AND MY DPE WILL NOT GIVE MY GUY AN SES CHECK-RIDE BECAUSE THERE IS THE POSSIBLITY THAT THIS GUYS LICENSE IS NOT EVEN VALID….

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3. 
   

   
   

   Alex Clark on Sep 24, 2012

   Well even when showing the above FAA opinion to the examiner, he still didn’t feel comfortable doing a new check-ride. A fine kettle of fish….
   So we put off the SES check-ride during a window of good weather (which is rare this year in Alaska.) and had to change over to having the client do 1.5 hours of night cross country…
   Now we just need to figure out how to get the FAA system to recognise that he is finally night qualified after 21 years……

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4. 
   

   
   

   Alex Clark on Oct 01, 2012

   How things are going so far: as of Oct 1, 2012, Being stone-walled

   THE FAA

   “Your local FAA Flight Standards District Office (FSDO) can give the best answer to your question. Their personnel will evaluate your question along with any specific issues you may have. You can find contact information for your local FSDO on our website at: http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/field_offices/fsdo/”

   ME:

   “I also passed the buck along to Anchorage FISDO….. HOWEVER, it is a National question……
   Prior to Aug 1997 anyone in the U.S.A. could obtain a private license without having night training. Thus they were Night Flight Prohibited.
   As a CFI I have met several from all over the country. So the question remains: Are all of these old (no night flight) pilots grand-fathered or did they all become invalid when the regulation changed?
   In the old FAA questions and answers ,, Alan Pinkston remarked that those old pilots were OK until they added a new rating. But the current regs say nothing about it and nobody since the old days of Alan Pinkston seems to want to give a yes or no answer… “””

   THE FAA:

   “””””We have forwarded your question to the appropriate FAA office for evaluation. We will send our reply to your question as soon as possible.

   Thank you for your question. “”””

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