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4 Answers

Is it a legal flight lesson or an illegal charter flight?

Asked by: 2781 views FAA Regulations

A student that is training for his Priavte Pilot ASEL wants his CFI to perform a flight lesson that entails a departure from home base and a stop at a destination that allows the Student to attend a doctors appointment there. At the conlusion of his doctors appointment he wants to do another flight lesson back to home base. The doctor appointment is to aquire an opinion that will clarify his probability in receiving a 3rd class medical. Can this flight be legally performed as flight training or will the FAA consider this a charter flight no matter what? The student rents the FBO airplane dry, the CFI that is provided to the student is on payroll at the FBO, and the student pays for fuel at a gal/hr consumption rate separately. If fuel is needed while off homebase the student pays for it.

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4 Answers



  1. KDS on Jun 06, 2018

    It’s a bit like the saying, “Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.” In this case, it’s whatever the judge says it is.

    “My OPINION” is that it is a legitimate training flight. However, my opinion and three dollars will get you a café latte at Starbucks.

    For starters, the student is an established student. There are cases out in the industry that are blatant, but they never go to the point of enforcement because the hard evidence isn’t there. This is extremely mild by comparison. After all, there is no regulation that says you can’t have fun in the process of learning.

    However, the way it would have to play out is for someone to first complain or it to somehow come to the attention of the FAA. What are the odds of that happening? Mighty slim. Then, in the grand scheme of things, is the FAA going to care? Almost certainly not. If an inspector does care and want to push it the odds are that an overworked government lawyer who is buried in work up to his ears is going to talk the inspector out of pursuing it unless he can come up with some damning evidence.

    I’d never say never, but the odds of it becoming an issue are mighty thin.

    Later, Midlifeflyer will probably come along and comment on your question. If he has a different answer than mine; believe his, not mine.

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  2. RyanPT22 on Jun 08, 2018

    For what it is worth, I did reach out to a FSDO and inquired about the scenario. They said, they needed an hour to research some legal interpretation and ask a couple superiors. Believe it or not that called me back within a couple hours and had some interesting information to convey. They informed me that due to the fact there are minimum training requirements in 61.109 that must be completed to earn a rating it is okay to the extent of the the training requirement and reasonable recurrent/proficiency training. They added that as long as the intent of the flight is to fulfill those requirement(s) and there is proof that training took place on the flight (ie. invoices, logbook entries, etc…) it doesn\’t matter what is happening at the destination; business, personal, leisure. Now this explanation even holds true for proficiency flights to a realistic extent. Explanation: if you have a student training to earn their FAA Private Pilot ASEL rating and their logbook is totaling over 100 hours and there are several of these unusual X-Country dual flights the HAMMER IS COMING DOWN! So this is good to know and to hear straight out of the horses mouth. Another reason why I like this is because it allows more realistic scenario based training.

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  3. KDS on Jun 10, 2018

    I suspect “any hammer coming down” would be so rare and the situation so gross as to be extreme beyond any glimmer of training value. Even if the FSDO manager didn’t tell the inspector to put his hammer back in his desk, it would still take buy-in from a government lawyer.

    FAA enforcements without precipitating events are rare. The real fear in the industry comes not from the FAA, but from the insurance company. It’s like the old joke about the chicken and pig’s contribution to a bacon and eggs breakfast. The chicken was involved, but the pig was committed. The FAA is involved, but the insurance company has money on the line and they don’t have to go to court to not renew a policy.

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  4. Mark Kolber on Jun 17, 2018

    Later, Midlifeflyer will probably come along and comment on your question.
    He might not have a better answer than those given. Besides, my malpractice carrier would have fits if I gave direct yes or no answers online (except in the absolutely clearest cases)!

    These things are not subject to easy answers. It is ultimately a fact-specific exercise in which “quacking like a duck” is more significant than dancing on the head of a pin.

    It is not at all uncommon to include a “real” trip for a real purpose in the course of training. Consider a pilot just buying something like a TBM. Insurance is going to require a certain amount of dual. I would be surprised if those hours did not include a business trip or two. Obviously rental aircraft pose a different problem, but what is the real difference between a doctor’s appointment and choosing a training destination for a non-aviation reason like there’s a good restaurant nearby or it’s somewhere that the pilot might want to take his family later?.

    I have a hard time seeing a problem with a discrete dual cross country during the course of training in which the cost of the aircraft and instructor is the same just because just because the destination has a purpose. But change the situation slightly – the doctor’s visit is for the student pilots’ spouse; it’s a Discovery Flight; “destination duals” are done weekly with transients – and the answer might change as well.

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